Encounters with the Nagual

[BratscheWarrior]

First, i really enjoyed this book. Thanks true for posting the link. To those who haven't read it, it is basically conversations between the author Armando Torres and Carlos Castaneda. To me it was great because Torres has only transcribed conversations. There is no real 'personal' involvement on his part. Very objective. I have to say that Castaneda's way of talking is a bit strange to me. Maybe because i'm used to Don Juan's way of explaining?

What do y'all think of this quote? i'm not quite sure why is will be advantageous to have the earth's assemblage point at the point of reason.

This is after Torres asked Castaneda what his task is:

"The task which my teacher gave me, and my mission as a nagual for the era which is commencing, is to move the assemblage point of the Earth."
"He explained that the assemblage point of Earth has changed many times in the past, and will do so in the future. In recent times it has been moving steadily towards the area of reason.

"That is magnificent, because, once it is fixated there, humanity will have an opportunity to move to the other side, and many men and women will become aware. The challenge for the seers of the future will be to maintain that focus for the necessary length of time until it becomes fixated there, becoming a permanent position for the planet, a new center, which we will be able to turn to anytime in a perfectly natural way. "

[admin]

Sorry but the book was Written by Julio Diana, a people with serious disorders, posing as an fake apprentice of Carlos.

I Had connections in the past with The editor of the book, and know of first hand. If u want more details, say, but as ai said, the book is a totally waste of time. The idea of Nagualism as a scientific method, as example, is a no sense, and in 1995 Carlos say he had no more apprentice. If u read spanish i can give u more info.

By the way i am now the owner of site editoraalba.com

[forfuckssake]

Cita:Sorry but the book was Written by Julio Diana, a people with serious disorders, posing as an fake apprentice of Carlos.

But he says in the intro that he is no way claiming to be an apprentice of Castaneda. Serious disorders? Isn't that a pre-requisite for walking the warrior's path?

Your comments sound a little like the folks over at sustainedaction.org

Having said that, who am I to say you're missing the point? I would like more info. but don't speak Spanish.

The book was powerful- for me, anyway. Thanks, true.

[BratscheWarrior]

i checked out your site Darakan (put through a translator) and i still don't understand how you come to your conclusion. Why do think that Torres think that he is an apprentice? Sitting and talking to a Nagual does not an apprentice make.

[ensonar]

I was very moved by this book. As with all of Castaneda's books, the information presented has affected me in such a way that I'm not at all concerned with any controversies surrounding it. The information in it is very direct and potent.

BratscheWarrior, as far as that quote, and many of the other revelations in the book, it seems like that's what I've always suspected after reading all of the other books. Revealing the teachings to the general public would seem a natural way of changing the modality of our time, or "shifting the assemblage point of the earth". Who knows(?) how quickly that will happen. I would assume that it would be something that will start out gradually, and as more and more people begin to awaken, it will pick up speed. Unless we kill ourselves first.

[true]

You're welcome, all who have thanked me.
It's funny we didn't find this sooner.
Makes me wonder what else is out there waiting for our attention to make it available.

As to value and truthfulness, I feel the same as with CC's books - not interested in if they describe actual events as much as I am interested in if the knowledge is useful and practical. This book enlightens some of CC's teachings for me. I find it hard to believe it isn't true. If not, the author, whoever it may be, certainly found a very similar AP position in order to expound on the points so profoundly. Obviously the book isn't a "waste of time". Did you read it, Darakan? Are you really going to say none of it is useful? That would go against the obvious for anyone. At a minimum, the book is like getting to discuss the points of CC's teachings with another warrior who has put some serious time and thought into them, not unlike what we do here. Speaking that way makes your credibility less than the author's, IMO, Darakan. You're not as objective/impersonal as whoever wrote the book.

As to the initial post about the AP of the earth, I'll have to read it again to get more context. Otherwise, it doesn't make sense to me either. I'd think that moving the earth to the AP of reason would be a few steps backward. I wouldn't want the earth to be "permanent" or "fixated" any more than I want myself to be.

We have to understand the definition intended for reason. If it's not given in the context, we'll have to agree on one. I remember in CC's books that for a long time he didn't understand what DJ meant by reason, then finally he saw he meant the tonal. If this is the meaning, I can certainly relate to the earth having a tonal, and I can relate to us, as custodians of the earth, grooming this tonal. But the quote you provided is too vague IMO to know why reason would make people aware when we're already at the point of reason, nor is it clear what will be different that we can turn to at any time in a natural way... how is that different from now?

I'll read the chapter again and come back if I see it any differently.

The word reason is difficult - I'd generally define it as using our mind, and therefore the past knowledge/inventory stored there, which will necessarily corrupt the present moment. If I could define it myself, the most reasonable thing to do would be to see - seeing is reasonable; reasoning isn't. B)

[true]

OK, I read it.
It sounds to me like it's a mass evacuation plan.
That to get a large number of people out of slavery, not just the seers, then someone, the seers, will have to move the AP of the earth closer to the AP of average men and women, which is reason. Apparently, this will make it possible to cross over to the realm of inorganic beings, which don't forget - we are inorganic beings in/as organic bodies.
DJ said that our destiny is to become inorganic beings, basically through death or through will/intent.
It sounds like CC's task is to make a cosmic vagina that ordinary people can pass through by aligning the emanations of the earth to those of common human beings.


That's my understanding of the chapter. Personally, I don't agree with it, but maybe I don't see enough. I'm old-fashioned, perhaps - people need to make the effort to cross over and that effort is their initiation and their passport. I don't see why anyone would want ordinary reason-based human beings to cross over unless they want to feed the IBs more directly, without shields. But then if they're (we're) sleeping anyway, why not? Humans serve a cosmic purpose: to be food for something, just as everything is food for something else, whether the Eagle or IBs - does it matter if you're asleep/dead already?
I can't imagine that reason-based beings will be able to function on the otherside without the training of a warrior-seer. Maybe this movement of the earth's AP will make an inorganic earth world that appears unchanged to the reason-based beings?
I don't feel that can be discussed without commenting on 2012 and the probability that most people will be killed anyway by the earth changes caused by Planet X/Nibiru as has happened repeatedly in the past. If these people are going to die, as predicted in the Bible and other sources, then maybe there's something to making a portal for them to the other side. I don't know. I'm mentally against saving people that don't want to save themselves. Will the ants give a shit about the grasshopper when winter comes? (Aesop's fables) Will I be human enough to care about the fate of humans? Personal enough to care about persons?

Well, it's CC's task, not mine. Maybe someday I'll see it as my own, but not today. I don't agree that this is a task for all seers:

Quote: "In fact, the task is not mine only but belongs to all the seers to come."

I see that there are some warriors who are concerned with their fellowmen and some who aren't, as DJ said. I don't think anyone needs to be saved. I'm not interested in that. According to the book, CC says the new seers discovered that this is part of the rule. I don't feel that the rule is the only option. I'm not in any sorcerer's party and I don't believe that that excludes me from freedom, so I guess I don't care about the rule. It hasn't been disclosed to me by a nagual and I haven't accepted it. And yet freedom is still a tangible thing for me.

[forfuckssake]

The earth's assemblage point is the same as any human; the reason it has to move to the point of reason is to make a crossing to silent knowledge possible.

In The Power of Silence, DJ calls it pure understanding. Only by arriving at the epicenter of reason can you ever hope to get to the place of silent knowledge. He also said the majority of humanity are really only fans of reason, they don't embody it but are in limbo between it and silent knowledge. That means (as I see it, of course ) the AP of "average men and women" is not at the point of reason; they just admire it from afar!

Recap from POS:
Pure understanding is experiencing "here and here" (as opposed to the "here and there" of up/down left/right light/dark etc. etc.; all false dualities). It is being in 2 places at once; the point of reason and silent knowledge.
(Remember Carlos running from the Jaguar in the desert or DJ being thrown into the river by the Nagual Julian?).

The only way for Earth to do this is if enough inhabitants within do it. Hence, the dissemination of the Warrior's Way through "publications" as Carlos said in Encounters with the Nagual.

Don't worry, True. "Ordinary" people won't be getting a free ride! It's the people who make the Warrior's Way their way (who become seers) that will gain the critical mass necessary for the Earth's assemblage point to reach reason and, hence, silent knowledge whereby the cosmic vagina, as you or Sylvio Manuel in The Eagle's Gift says, will open up and the flight to freedom (or that place in Orion that Castaneda mentions in Encounters, The Dome of Intent or whatever) becomes accessible.

The people who follow the "publications" (recapitulation, tensegrity, dreaming etc.) and store enough energy (and are selected by the Spirit I guess) will be "noticed" by a nagual of a random sorcerers' party just like Armando Torres got noticed and accepted. He was the example for the rest of us to follow. Carlos said it is unavoidable that a Nagual will find you once reach the energy body. UNAVOIDABLE!!!

The task is not to help humanity; it's to help yourself! By doing that, by really doing that (by being a miser of energy and intending freedom), the task will get accomplished as a result.

So let the lineages grow and let's move Mother Earth!!!






PS erm.. just my opinion...

[ensonar]

Thanks, for fuck's sake! That was well put and helped my understanding nicely.

[admin]

Sorry For my delay in answer. I have Some months of extra work.

First saturday of month, i go to a Restaurant in Mexico, Sanborns of "Los Azulejos", and that is normal last ten years.

Well, one of the people who go normally between 2000 2004 was Julio Diana. Some of the Things i Said in the meetings, was transcripted LITERALLY in the Encounters with the Nagual Book. I kick off out Julio Diana when was evident he is a crazy man, a sick person, and lately he accept have history of mental disorders.

Other was altered. As example, i say normally some similarities and diffs between social and natural sciense, and the Torres book say the Nagualism is a Scientific Method.

And many many more ...

Think yourself, why Torres is not searched again for the chacmools or The "trnunphant" editorial houses ?

Because is easy, with documents, show the bounds between Diana and Torres, and Julio Diana life is a can of shet, he and his partner, Frank Diaz, have very serious problem with many guvernamental agencies.

Well ...

Julio Diana made the initial Promotion of the Torres book in many forums in english and spanish.

In a Strange deviaton of the things, i meet some months later Eddy Martinelli, the editor of "Editora Alba", but Martinelli was searching for a self financed authors, and Martinelli Kick the ass of Julio Diana off of the Editora Alba because Julio Diana was catched searching the Martinelli Pc.

Later, because criminal things involved in the new age project called Kinam, Julio Diana become again visible, and in a self defense manouver i bought the editoraalba.com , and receive some other evidence about the fact of the bounds between Torres and Julio Diana.

[admin]

Sorry For my delay in answer. I have Some months of extra work.

First saturday of month, i go to a Restaurant in Mexico, Sanborns of "Los Azulejos", and that is normal last ten years.

Well, one of the people who go normally between 2000 2004 was Julio Diana. Some of the Things i Said in the meetings, was transcripted LITERALLY in the Encounters with the Nagual Book. I kick off out Julio Diana when was evident he is a crazy man, a sick person, and lately he accept have history of mental disorders.

Other was altered. As example, i say normally some similarities and diffs between social and natural sciense, and the Torres book say the Nagualism is a Scientific Method.

And many many more ...

Think yourself, why Torres is not searched again for the chacmools or The "trnunphant" editorial houses ?

Because is easy, with documents, show the bounds between Diana and Torres, and Julio Diana life is a can of shet, he and his partner, Frank Diaz, have very serious problem with many guvernamental agencies.

Well ...

Julio Diana made the initial Promotion of the Torres book in many forums in english and spanish.

In a Strange deviaton of the things, i meet some months later Eddy Martinelli, the editor of "Editora Alba", but Martinelli was searching for a self financed authors, and Martinelli Kick the ass of Julio Diana off of the Editora Alba because Julio Diana was catched searching the Martinelli Pc.

Later, because criminal things involved in the new age project called Kinam, Julio Diana become again visible, and in a self defense manouver i bought the editoraalba.com , and receive some other evidence about the fact of the bounds between Torres and Julio Diana.

[BratscheWarrior]

i still don't understand your conclusions...Who is Julio Diana?

If you compare Castaneda's use of language to the little stories on the Cleargreen site (for the seminars) to the Torres book, you will find that it is the same.

Once again, Torres never claims to be an apprentice. If i recall correctly, he only "had conversations with Carlos from time to time."

And...i was discussing this briefly with my ummmmm...helper. And he said that it is legit.

The evidence is overwhelming to me.

And where does Torres say that Nagualism is a scientific method? Are we talking about the same book here?

[BratscheWarrior]

i still don't understand your conclusions...Who is Julio Diana?

If you compare Castaneda's use of language to the little stories on the Cleargreen site (for the seminars) to the Torres book, you will find that it is the same.

Once again, Torres never claims to be an apprentice. If i recall correctly, he only "had conversations with Carlos from time to time."

And...i was discussing this briefly with my ummmmm...helper. And he said that it is legit.

The evidence is overwhelming to me.

And where does Torres say that Nagualism is a scientific method? Are we talking about the same book here?