Dream time or Ensueño
Hi Again,
According to Don Juan,
The World we live in now is only a description that was given to us at birth. (I agree)
But then he talks about how we need to undo the ways thing are or stop time (the world)
Ok then my question is that when we are in Ensueño or dream time, why do we continue to use the same description of the world that was given to us at birth? What description should we apply?
I dont know too much about this so Im just trying to understand
Quetzal
D5 Creation
Maybe the quickest answer is not the better. Dreaming is a method, using many times for persons without a soul, seeking an escape of the real world.
Maybe you can better see whaty i want say, reading the thread called “El terrible inconveniente” in the “conocimiento silencioso subforum”
Maybe can help u more if i say you is wonderful dream, but is better not betrayal the dreams.
Ok I will read it
then I’ll reply
Quetzal
Another problem of dreaming technique is he fact of is a subjective experiencie and for it is very hard to check with another people.
Check and probe the personal advance.
Ok,
So the experiences of all defer from person to person?
Quetzal
In subjective matters yes.
verificable dreaming is an oxymoron
Yes but can I say, that waking life and dreaming go hand in hand as if it were a single unit?
I think that both are composed of the samething,
could that be the Nagual?
What makes both these posible, Cause we can see Waking and Dreaming but what makes them exists?
Quetzal
Well… if u dont manage, and understand this world, you cant manage or dont understamd the magic/dreaming world.
The magic world is not a way of escape.
If u can USE the knowledge of the dreaming, ok for u.
Let me explain what I understand about this:
1.- the world is a description given at birth, only a description
2-. when you are awake, you interact with the world under that codes, under that description, and it can be verified by those around you because they also have that same description of the world, they have the same codes, unified by reason.
3.- But when you are dreaming, nobody can verify what you are living (dreaming) because you are the only one who knows the codes of your dreaming. If you are not a dreamer, you are not able to interpret your dreaming, wich means your dreaming is something like useless. If you are a good dreamer it means you are able to interpret and give order into your dreaming, which means is being useful.
Is like creating an observer through your dreaming but also through your reason.
What makes both these posible, Cause we can see Waking and Dreaming but what makes them exists?
I don’t know what makes them exist but I think it is our description of the world what makes the exist in separate ways.
Of course, this is only my humble opinion.
Berenice
You made some good points Berenice.
The problem is many people cant control the real world, then is imporbable , but no immposible, alter the dream way.
I agree with Berenice too…and also, what I can understand from Nagual’s arguments is that perhapps the lessons of dreamming should come after the lessons in ” the real world”. Also that we have to observe our lives first, and see how we are dealing with our daily challenges instead of looking for “new” challenges in our dream state…I am guessing also, that once you get enough control over your life, then “dreaming” and “the real” will come hand in hand.
Berenice, Tatanka, Nagual
Thank you all for the Input. I have to say that the way Berenice put things really helped me understand. Thank you
Also Nagual And Tatanka Your Input was good too. I understand that it is better to take on a challenge at a time.
This has really cleared things up.
Thank you
Quetzal
You are welcome.
We think Berence say wise things, and her post is a good resume. Then, i close this topic. Anyone can open another, without problem.